starter motor sounds like a machine gun!

Sounds like the starter/flywheel teeth not meshing
Roll it forward or backward a metre or so in gear and try agian

 

if stigs solution works you have damaged flywheel teeth

if not perhaps very loose starter bolts
or the starter solenoid isn't pushing the starter gear out far enough
or the starter gear is stripped

 

No, the starter gear teeth have lost their edge and won't go into the flywheel teeth, I have a starter here that does that.

Either set is stripped and you get a horrible grinding sound

 

I'm with ya Stigster.


It's very rare (almost impossible) that flywheel teeth are screwed but starter teeth are another story considering the work they have to do.

Pull the starter and have a gig at the teeth and while your at it, pull that sucker apart and give it a proper clean out while checking brushes etc......


This Banshee bitch is a new relationship for you :shock :mrgreen and is sure to bring her 'issues' with her :mrgreen ......... did the previous owner happen to mention the starter, he must of known or are you just unlucky :aargh

 

Been sitting awhile may explain the 'laziness' of the starter. Check the brushes etc.


Yeah it's a PITA............ nothing a few beverages and tunes can't fix (while your at it) on this sunday, it's pissing and miserable here in Ballina at the minute :cheers2

You also never know what you'll find/fix while your at it :thumbsup:


GO STORM............. Tough game with the Dogs but we still took home the party pies :mrgreen

 

Show us the teeth on the flywheel and the starters

 

It might not be the starter at all - my wifes Corolla used to make the machine-gun noises when trying to start if it had been sitting a while, it was just low charge in the battery, jump start or clutch start it and let it charge for a bit (or use a trickle charger if you've got one) and see if it goes way.

 

that or a rotten power wire

 

teeth look good. 09 used to occasionally do the machine gun bit. id have to tap the starter selinoid (sp?) with a hammmer a few times.

 

I'd have to agree that the teeth look good I can't even see any rounding or grinding on the ends of the starter teeth
and since you have tried 2 different starters it seems unlikely that they both are not getting the solenoid to push the
gear in far enough to engage the flywheel.

Here's a couple shots pf a 3sge flywheel this is the side the starter teeth engage with


and the other side


So I don't really see any issues with your flywheel or starter teeth

As a matter of fact if you know how the starter and solenoid work
the starter will not rotate the starter gear until it has engaged with
flywheel its physically impossible . If you take the cover in the picture
of the back of the solenoid you'll find a long rod which pushes the
starter gear into the flywheel and once it has pushed it far enough
it makes an electrical contact which starts the starter motor. So the
starter gear does not actually rotate until the gear has been pushed
a fair distance.


I fear the motor is rotating and you may have clutch problems.....hope I'm wrong,
does the flywheel feel solid, you can't wiggle it can you ? maybe loose flywheel bolts

So I think the real question that needs to be answered is

When you try to start the car and hear this noise is the starter motor
actually rotating the engine ? is the altenator turning ?

 

Those flywheel teeth look good, the starter teeth should be angled too - those look flat?

What happens is the starter wire engages the coil around the tube you see in the pics, that pulls the piston in which engages the motor and the flywheel (Bendix) at the same time.
For some reason the piston isn't staying engaged and the banging is the piston trying to get engaged which normally is a clicking sound - so it does suggest the starter teeth aren't engaging.

Anyone got a pic of what the starter teeth are supposed to look like?
From memory I think mine were angled like this


Have you tried rocking the car in gear between starts?

 

Sounds like your solenoid is having trouble pushing the starter gear all the way out if your battery is fine, mine does the same thing when the battery is low.

If you need any starter motor parts I've got a whole one from off of my old parts car.

 

Man, speaking of starters, yesterday I rudely found out that there are two starters that fit a 3SGE...and the one that O'Reilly gave me didn't have the threaded hole for the heat shield...needless to say that slows down my attempt to kill the "burp" thread while I wait for the correct one.

Vic

 

a couple shots of spare starters
totally flat teeth


one side angled

starter teeth don't have to be angled the flywheel teeth has a special cut in them on one side to help
guide the starter gear in you can see the extra angle cut well in this picture, its designed to rotate the
starter gear a few degrees counter clockwise if necessary, but as you can see in my above pics one starter
does have the starter gear teeth angled on one side and I would guess this is probably a better design

If the starter is the problem then it has to be with this part circled in red which toyota calls a magnetic switch
which as I have said before does 2 things in sequence
1- push the starter gear out and hold it there
2- once the gear has been pushed out it will send 12 volts to the starter motor

So are you saying that the magnetic switch is cycling on and off quickly and therefor
causing this rod to cycle back and forth and that the noise is basically just the rod
hitting at both ends of the cycle ?



this picture shows step 2 of the starter process, once the plunger in the picture above
has been depressed far enough it will make a contact between the 2 plates pictured
below in red boxes and cause 12 volts to flow from the big battery cable attached to
the starter to the starter motor but this only happens after the starter gear has been
fully engaged


Other starter porn for Stig

 

The only other starter that fits is from the 1S, 2S motors - I don't think they had shields as the exhaust is at the back.

Yeah Dave, mine were all angled and so is the FE starters.
I think the flat type is for the flywheel with angled teeth and the slanted type is for the flywheel with flat teeth.
Note how Rev's is running very high on the flywheel, I think he needs the slanted type tooth starter to solve this problem.

I thought it may be the solenoid but 2 bad solenoids? more like not enough current to the solenoid or very dirty inside?
Test for current is to short the solenoid wire to the + terminal with a screwdriver

 

You should never hit any part of a starter with a hammer, they contain ceramic magnets that will shatter and then you've got a much bigger problem.

On topic; Check all the wires for rot/corrosion like this jwagner said, that will definitely stop the starter working properly.

I've also just noticed, my spare starter has a heat shield and the one I'm using doesn't. Is there any advantage to the one with the heat shield?

Both have slanted teeth IIRC.