Shimless Buckets

Gen1 or 2/3/4?
Gen1's are a lot smaller than the others

 

I know Willie uses shimless buckets made for the gen1 heads, I think they come from a Toyota Echo but of no use to your gen2 head.

Any idea of availabilty and price?

Please go into your 1st post and change the heading to Gen 2/3/4 shimless buckets before someone makes a very expensive mistake

 

If no one here has seen this thread below, you are now set for life >

http://www.alltrac.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=24542

 

Quick question, can some industrial strenght glue solve the issue of shim clearance as per demo pic in that thread. I cant see why it wouldnt?

 

Like I said Mafix has those buckets fitted and we did have a listing here too but seems to have gone AWOL in the crash along with ECU listings and some other usefull information.

I've never heard the glue idea and I don't think it will work, if it did work the shims would become solid lifters and you'd have to buy new shims and buckets to adjust them.

Actually my experience is that the oil under the shim does act like a glue and sometimes it's damn difficult to get the shim out due to the vaccum seal underneath it, I don't have high lift cams but I can believe the shims lifting on the smaller gen1 buckets which is why I don't recommend more than 8,5mm lift with the gen1 head.

This is the main reason guys like 1FSTGTS and myself have bought gen2/3 heads and the fact that there are heaps of a/m cams for the later heads while the gen1 cams are being phased out and the gen1 shims are no longer in stock

Shim adjustment tips - http://www.st162.net/forum/showthrea...ll=1#post54898

 

defo doing this

 

Yes it is a lot of money - for those not running high lift motors it's money wasted imo.
Below 9mm of lift and you're OK with shim on top, over 9mm and shimless or shim under is the only options.
I'm going with the gen3 shim under setup as it's the cheapest, easiest most reliable route for me, I intend fitting gen3 cams and the inlet on those has almost 10mm lift, the Beams engines have even higher lift.

I think once a motor is run in and the shims are set properly it's something you forget about for a few years, the problem is the initial setup and running in that demands time and money

I'm a big believer in dual springs in any high revving motor, I'm confused as to why Toyota didn't use them in all their 16v motors

 

$$$$$$$

 

Hardly, you'll find them in just about every Alfa since 1977. I think big T has a few more dollars than them

 

I would think that there is a small HP increase due to the loss of weight in motion. On an even more minute scale I would also think there is less power lost through the cam lobes striking a singular object as opposed to two objects that function as one. The fact that the shim is not part of the bucket has to equate to some power loss, however small. I wish there were a way to quantify this, but I don't think there is..... I like science. I'm a nerd.

 

Yes Kev it all helps
Also the lighter the retainers and buckets/shims the better the valves will respond and reduce the chance of valves floating or bouncing at high revs.

In F1 motors one of the reasons they are able to rev beyond 20 000 is that there are no cams, the valves are operated by compressed air.

Another good design is the Ducati desmodric valve system which has a lever to pull the valve upward and prevent bounce

 

my though was that it was more to prevent spitting shims during float at high rpm. TODA still makes a kit for $2K for gen 1, but iirc only "recomends" them on cams w/ over 9mm lift like stig was saying. they have a good cam reference on thier site.

 

^that's true for sure.....