Im still a hardcore fan of the 1G 3S - still the least expensive to mod with BPU's when compaired to the other gens... -Supra CT26A are cheap and plentiful, bolts right up - complete and with the least modifications. Price wise compaired to the CT20B - for the 2G 3SGTE, I can buy a brand new rebuilt 46 trim or two really good cores for the same price as CT20B. -1G 3SGE cams are a bolt in and measure 240* duration - same as the 3G 3SGTE intake cam for the 2G 3SGTE but alot cheaper and easier to obtain. -Shimless bucket conversion from the 1SZ-FE, CAnadian Echo hatchback -ATS sells 264 regrinds for cheaper than HKS 264's for the 2G 3S. -Top feed rail leaves for more injector options and its already been tested and proven that the 1G fuel rail doesnt have a pressure drop like the 2G rails do, so save some cash and no need to upgrade the rail. -1G 3SGE side feed intake manifold bolts right up, so gain the increased plenum volume and better distribution of air for cheap as these are relatively inexpensive to obtain as well. -I actually preffer the seperate and external oil cooling set up of the 1G 3S compaired to the 2G 3S as it makes in-corporating an external oil cooler and/or oil filter re-location kit alot simpler. -Honestly the only disadvantage I see regarding the 1G is the fact that their is no aftermarket support for valves and springs, but any reputable engine race shop can custom fit bigger valves and stiffer springs. -Also the 1G exhaust manifold is crack prone but if you can source a crack free manifold I would suggest you send it out to have it magnafluxed, ported, shotpeened and HPC coated for longevity. -The only bolt on aftermarket DP for the 1G is made by Au$$ie. Other than that anything that applies to the 2G 3S applies to the 1G 3s ie. stroker kits, rods, pistons, oil pans, oil pumps, HG, ARP hardware.... Things that wont apply are generation specific turbo kits or anything related to the drivetrain components of the head.
i also prefer the 1st gen motor some notes of mine though... 2g head flows much better and has much larger valves stock i don't see why people don't use 1g rails on 2g heads any DSM, Honda low impedence injector drops right in. from what i've seen and read there are suttle differences in the blocks and the 1st gen is the better of the 4 special damn flywheel... it's 20 years old and mine competes with new vettes
Compared to my mates St185, he feels like his has more low down torque, we have almost idential engine mods, bar my hybrid. I really rate the first gen 3sgte. however i do think that the late model ST205 is the best base for monster power. Certainly compared to my previous fords the engine is far stronger and over engineered.
technically speaking. if you wan tthe most bang for your buck a 1st gen bock with a 5s crank, 2nd gen head, 3rd gen everything else.
Why the 2nd gen head, most of the big power guys over here, fensport etc have gone Gen 3 head? A lot of people have big issues with spliting late model blocks, although it could be because the majority of 400bhp + have started with gen 3 lumps
Its the opposite in the UK, loads of bits for gen 3s, but a whole heap less for gen 1s I think due the fact that there are prob less the 150 left runing in the entire country! We have an issue with lots of cylinder heads cracking, and turbo housings doing the same, but not really seen reports of this on the US sites, any ideas what would cause this? I have learnt a lot about suppliers from the site, so its great to find out more, as the gen 1 is really overlooked in UK, Infact there are very few big power Gen 1 powered cars, the majority of bigger power 165s all run Gen 2 power. I think the common perception is that the ecu, fueling and head design, all make the swap worth it. Are the slight power differences quote between models down to emmision equipment or the ratings of your fuel?
I have to agree and disagree with some of the statements made... Firstly, I agree with the fact that the 2G fueling is the worst of all the generations. In places like the UK and Japan 3G engines and parts are more readily available and easier to source than the always depleting number of 1G 3S's. Yes there are alot more 3G making big power compaired to 1G but that has alot to do with the statement I made previously. The 2G and 3G are better plateforms to begin with in the quest for making power and they make more right out of the box, however for some that already have a 1G "modifing" our 1G 3S engines are alot more inexpensive than modifing a 2G or 3G. On top of that 1G 3S's go for alot less at an importers compaired to there later generation siblings. Secondly, I disagree with the notion that the 2G head is a better head than the 3G, in fact the 3G head is far superior than the 2G. It flows more stock vs. stock and mod vs. mod, the "only" place the 2G head outperforms the 3G head is when it is fully worked over and only in the high RPM band - good only for drag racing. The 3G block is not aluminum it is in fact cast iron like its predecessors. Every generation has its own specific short comings, but most are still shared between them the fact that you hear alot more of one in one particular generation is attributted to the fact that alot more of them are in use but they all still share alot of there common problems. Some of these include, hair line cracks - especially in and around major stud openings like the head bolts in the block deck and exhaust studs in the head as well as weak connecting rod bolts. More specific issues pertaining to each generation include: -1G is infamous for the turbo and exhaust manifolds cracking. -2G and 1G share paper head gaskets that are all to egar to fail at times. -3G is now famous for the block cracking issue between 2 and 3 cylinder bores.
i didn't mean that the gen 2 head was better i meant for us it's much easier to modify. i always thought the 3rd gen block was alu...mabye it's the gen4 that's alu. headgaskets suck out of the box, even for the 7mgte guys, one of the first mods. and i have no idea why the 3rd gens crack the block. perhaps it's from too much boost pressure and just not enough meat in the block? or could it actually be in the metalurgy of the iron they used. perhaps it's a cheaper metal that weighs less?
Actually the GEN3 head is still easier to modify than the GEN2 head. The GEN3 head doesnt require machining of the lifter bores to accept high lift cams unlike the GEN2 head, smaller ports for increased air velocity and shim under bucket lifters. Also the intake manifold has a larger plenum, larger throttle body, single runners istead of two for each port and no TVIS. There is actually a guy on AT.net selling a really nice custom side feed intake mani for realitively cheap, might be another option for you instead of hacking up a perfectly good GE manifold. The reason the GEN3 blocks are so crack prone is becasue of the siamised water jackets between 2 and 3 cylinder, the casting is too thin in that area.
weld up some tube runners than...the hard part is already done - plenum with the velocity stacks and the port flange with the TVIS gutted.
yes but for that money i can make one. between myself and my friends we are still working on a good design that we hope will work like a factory one. it looks like we are goign to be keeping tvis, mustang 70mm throttle body, custom volumizer with extra ports, and using a stock GE manifold as a base. i have a good feeling it will work very well. factory intakes are good to nearly 500hp on the motor so i don't see a need for eliminating tvis or dual runner.
